14 replies to this topic

[tidbit]

This thread is to try and stop all the thread hi-jacking from this wave of Guests that thinks everything needs to be argued.

So uh.. quote the post and/or link a topic and discuss. KEEP IT OUT OF THE MAIN TOPIC.

[tidbit]

Let me start:

also, look! a guest giving (unhelpful) help!
Sure, he's helping. but gives no info, no links, just a potential answer. then a non-anon is nice and explains stuff.
So anons, please stop arguing/ranting. it goes both ways. If you want us to be 'nicer' and give more info and answers, you need to aswell.

What are you talking about. Providing a solution is way nicer than throwing the word RTFM. If you want guests to be nicer you are the one who need to start being nice.

1) RTFM was not said in that thread at all.
2) although it is nice in 1 way, it is also NOT helpful in another way.
The user does not learn anything except "it might work". He doesn't learn why A_Index needs to be outside the quotes and the 2 sections around the variable are re-wrapped in quotes.

If you directly spoon-feed the answer, give an explanation too.

Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. - Chinese Proverb

[Tuncay]

I am a big fan of explanations, especially for beginners and trivial things (seldom!). If I have the time and knowledge to teach how and why something happens or is needed, then I try to do my best. But to protect the guest, tidbit, you do not know how well the person can write in English and maybe he was lazy or had no time to explain the code.

Depending on the question, a simple code correction is all what the asked person needs. In your example an explanation or point to the right place in the documentation would not only be nice, but needed.

I think, let such people post simple corrections, thats better than nothing. And I have absolutely no problem with them.

And I like this quote:

Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.

[nimda]

Give a man a fish, or he yells at you for trying to teach him

[tank]

I like how no anon so far in this thread perhaps the anon in the title is a good way to keep them out.

@nimda dont you think in fairness that perhaps sometimes offer the more complex solution (class definition etc). Yes there are plenty of ingrates in our forum. but sometimes we egg it on too :wink: I am by no means suggesting this is the case most of the time but it does happen dont you think?

now to all the guests who come to this forum asking for a fish
When you post your are asking for the kindness of others who have in most cases only separated themselves from you by taking the time to learn the environment by example and documentation. I would say of those asking where a rtm is not the appropriate response 90% are just Folks who do not understand how to develop an algorithm. 5% want to find a way to overcome game restrictions and refuse to acknowledge it may not work. and the last bit are litterally trying to re invent the wheel of some windows based utilities

[tank]

those are far and few between wouldnt you aggree looking at the bulk of the forum posts in ask for help
Further more i was refering to things like screen locks and protecting content etc

[tidbit]

Whichever Guest is making these posts: STOP going off-topic.

Also, as I said before, I have very rarely seen a "rtfm" or "google it" or "search for it".
Those that have said that stuff often times link directly to the needed material.
I understand not everyone may know english perfectly, but they can ask "what does this mean?" on the linked pages. Prove they atleast put forth a little bit of effort. Not just a half-arsed "how do i autofir? tnx".

I can also quote a section from the ubuntu rules.

RTFM [and] "Go look on google" are two inappropriate responses to a question. If you don't know the answer or don't wish to, please say nothing instead of brushing off someone's question. Politely showing someone how you searched or obtained the answer to a question is acceptable, even encouraged.
...
If you wish to remind a user to use search tools or other resources when they have asked a question you feel is basic or common, please be very polite. Any replies for help that contain language disrespectful towards the user asking the question, i.e. "STFU" or "RTFM" are unacceptable and will not be tolerated.
—Ubuntu Forums

Linking to a doc page is polite. Linking them to multiple pages is also polite.

Some stats: I searched for "RTFM" in the Ask for Help section in the past year.
I found about ~5 negative RTFM's.
. of those, a couple were by Guests.
. Someone also mis-understood and apologized.
. On one of them, someone gave a link to the info and some basic help, but the person needing got a bit moody and just wanted to be spoon fed without trying.
And there were several occurrences where the person needing help said "I should have RTFM'd" (people telling themselves to rtfm? Nice.).

[tidbit]

@ 1st Guest
Thats true but there has never been a 2.5 page debate on a single topic in that thread. and the topic is "whats on your mind ... update your status daily or weekly" not "debate your opinion with 5 others and keep going in circles."
Break out and make a new topic. Or maybe a Mod can do that for you.

@ 2nd Guest
Please define your idea of an RTFM post and give some recent samples (preferably 'rude' ones that makes your blood boil).

[nimda]

@ 2nd Guest
10 links are worth a 1000 words...

[tidbit]

Guest, you joined in late on the argument. you did not start it (I think).
However, how can I tell which one did? you all hide under the same mask, put no effort in even adding a 1 or 3869 or ImAGuest to your name.

Looking back, it lightly starts out on page 63, post 2. the escalates to where we are now.

[tank]

interesting i searched the words "go away" and my name and came up with 28 posts. this one will make 29 any how i actually in re reading those only 2 were rude and both well one was to an anon who was being a bigger jackass than me and the other was a smart alic comment that no one would take to mean go away literally unless they have less than 5th level reading

if however your talking about this
<!-- m -->http://www.autohotke... ... 943#415943<!-- m -->
the That was neither rude nor smart ass. it was sincere. that is exactly the kind of poster that we should run out of dodge or give a severe wake up call too

For those that disagree Your welcomed to. However I will always take an offensive stance against being supportive of black hat code requests. this isn't a hacker forum and i don't want to see that sort of element around here i don't really think any one else seriously does either.