"www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

Discussion about the AutoHotkey Foundation and this website
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tank
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

06 Dec 2018, 09:42

Drugwash wrote:
09 Nov 2018, 10:15
...YOUR power of decision...
If you think that then you are wrong. I have been actively engaging in any way i could find including looking for a cheap lawyer. If you have suggestions, i am all ears, otherwise...
joedf wrote:
06 Nov 2018, 23:05
Ok, redirect changed to www.*
Let's leave it that way anyway
SOTE wrote:
06 Nov 2018, 01:18
Well, you can do this in Firefox too under "Options", "Privacy & Security",
Thanks but i will refrain from recommending browser changes to accommodate Google Idiocy.
nnnik wrote:
05 Nov 2018, 18:09
Well if we are really grasping at straws we might as well replace the directory listing with a proper HTML site.
About # 3 or 4 on my priority list as soon as i finish changing jobs this month
We are troubled on every side‚ yet not distressed; we are perplexed‚
but not in despair; Persecuted‚ but not forsaken; cast down‚ but not destroyed;
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

06 Dec 2018, 11:10

More or less, Google is not blocking the downloads anymore AKAIK... I believe tank had added a block (return a harmless blank page) on googleBot. or whatnot...
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SOTE
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

06 Dec 2018, 12:27

Things look good on Google Safe Browsing, no warnings anymore (https://transparencyreport.google.com/s ... ing/search)
However, VirusTotal still gives a warning from Google Safe Browsing, while all the Anti-Virus vendors shows the link is clean. (https://www.virustotal.com/#/home/url). I suppose this is because the information VirusTotal is using is old and not updated yet, though that seems a little bit odd to me. Not sure how long that Google Safe Browsing changed the status for AutoHotkey, so I guess we can see again in a few days.
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

06 Dec 2018, 14:48

tank wrote:
06 Dec 2018, 09:42
Drugwash wrote:
09 Nov 2018, 10:15
...YOUR power of decision...
If you think that then you are wrong. I have been actively engaging in any way i could find including looking for a cheap lawyer. If you have suggestions, i am all ears, otherwise...
We most likely have a misunderstanding here. I meant people (users) should be the ones to decide for themselves whether to do something or not (such as browsing the AHK site, downloading/using it etc), not let third-parties like google and the likes tell them what (not) to do. Sure, you can waste time and money paying a lawyer that would sue google (ha!) but that won't open people's eyes. They need proper education and that's a can of worms I'd rather not open now.
I've deleted my CloudMe account because of GDPR - the now legal base for privacy invasion and data theft.
SOTE
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

26 Dec 2018, 23:54

The AutoHotkey community definitely needs to keep watch on Google. Here we are weeks later and supposedly a clean bill of health from Google Safe Browsing, and VirusTotal (owned by Google) is still showing that AutoHotkey download directories for version 1 (AutoHotkey_Basic) and 1.1 (AutoHotkey_L) have malware and are malicious. Which makes no sense, since Google Safe Browsing shows it as safe, so why doesn't VirusTotal report the same information is anybody's guess.

To see, put the AutoHotkey download directory https://www.autohotkey.com/download/1.1/ on the VirusTotal Url scan https://www.virustotal.com/#/home/url

The concern with that is the catch-22, where when other anti-virus and anti-malware companies see a bad report from Google Safe Browsing, they lazily do the same. Looks like the other vendors have become a bit smarter about this, but the issue and the Google trap appears to be still present.
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Tigerlily
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

13 Mar 2019, 10:47

SOTE wrote:
26 Dec 2018, 23:54
The AutoHotkey community definitely needs to keep watch on Google. Here we are weeks later and supposedly a clean bill of health from Google Safe Browsing, and VirusTotal (owned by Google) is still showing that AutoHotkey download directories for version 1 (AutoHotkey_Basic) and 1.1 (AutoHotkey_L) have malware and are malicious. Which makes no sense, since Google Safe Browsing shows it as safe, so why doesn't VirusTotal report the same information is anybody's guess.

To see, put the AutoHotkey download directory https://www.autohotkey.com/download/1.1/ on the VirusTotal Url scan https://www.virustotal.com/#/home/url

The concern with that is the catch-22, where when other anti-virus and anti-malware companies see a bad report from Google Safe Browsing, they lazily do the same. Looks like the other vendors have become a bit smarter about this, but the issue and the Google trap appears to be still present.
Hello Friends,

So I've been sort of monitoring AutoHotkey SEO health for the last couple of months and there is a ton of work to be done to help make Google "trust" AutoHotkey. There are numerous "authoritative" articles out there claiming that AHK has become more and more a source of Malware creation as time continues, this is just plain BAD for AutoHotkey.com's reputation on the "Google-net". Some articles must be published on trustworthy, authoritative websites which (1) combat this misinformation (in a professional way), or at least offer a different take on "facts", and (2) gains visibility in the search engine by backlinks, quotes, etc. Without this, AutoHotkey will continue to be flagged as malware in Google's eyes. There is simply not enough credibility out on the "Google-net" that shows that AutoHotkey is not primarily used for creating modern day Malware.

One thing that is very apparent is the download page itself. The way that it is laid out structurally and visually automatically is a red flag to Google. It simply does not "appear" authoritative or "safe". The title tag is very simple (not an issue, but could be optimized better to receive higher traffic). The meta description and H1 tags are non-existant. This needs to be fixed - I'd be happy to volunteer to does some keyword research and optimize these.

This is an example which clearly shows that AutoHotkey is not as trusted as another download page I recently stumbled upon:

Seach "download slack" or "download skype" in Google. Notice how Google trusts these two sites/programs so much that it offers a big visual box with logo that helps increase click-thru-rates and reads "Go to download" (aka Call-to-Action or CTA). This is because Google trusts these sites so much it wants people who are searching this term to take the next step and download the associated app. This is Google's way of rewarding trustworthy, authoritative websites (one of them anyways).

Okay, now do me a favor and click in through that CTA and look around at those webpages visually without scrolling down or anywhere. Now look at AutoHotkey's download page and tell me which looks more trustworthy? Tell me which one you would feel more safe clicking on to download the associated application? If you say "the AutoHotkey download page", then you have something wrong with your intuition and common sense (or maybe just being stubborn or short-sighted). It's pretty clear which page looks more authoritative from Google's standpoint - but going deeper, the reason Google trusts these pages more is because of two things: (1) These applications likely have mega-tons of authoritative backlinks from other authoritative websites - their reputation can't really be argued because of this, they are simply trusted and used in high-frequency, (2) Users are going to feel safer here - it's easy to tell this from (a) an algorithmic standpoint, (b) visual inspection of page (both "above-the-fold" and "below-the-fold"), and (c) as I mentioned above, these sites have years and years of "GOOD" reputation so users will likely download and move on without clicking out of the website and looking elsewhere for downloads.

There needs to be more structure to the download page, like found on the home page of AutoHotkey. Pictures, colors, descriptions, opinions, etc will all help build more trustworthiness to this download page. The download page doesn't really "fit" visually with the rest of AHK's website - it looks like an ugly stepchild that got neglected. This page is important because it's going to continue to be one of the most freqented AHK pages. The more people that click into it from Google Search and then click out because they didn't feel safe, weren't sure if it was the right download page/link, got confused by structure or lack of descriptions, etc., the more Google will "distrust" this web page and ultimately autohotkey.com in general.

At the very least, autohotkey.com should be on-par with AutoIT.com in terms of page structure and page content best practices, otherwise it will always be seen as less trustworthy than it's competitor (in Google's eyes).

Hiring a lawyer to deal with this situation likely will not help, or will take so long to remedy that way it just won't be worth it. Autohotkey needs a healthy dose of ongoing SEO implementations, or will continue to struggle with these issues - even if you somehow win a lawsuit against Google regarding this (highly doubtful).

Other site issues that pose problems:

non-descriptive URL structures
not enough internal content to learn about AutoHotkey and "explore" AutoHotkey from the home page - while forums are great and important, they cannot "fill-in" this lack of content
internal linking structure is not great
lack of purposeful internal linking throughout website


There are more, but not going to go into detail here.
-TL
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

13 Mar 2019, 11:03

Thanks. Couple of things to note. Lexikos owns that entire directory which is updated by script when he uploads. If i change it it will simply be overwritten. other than that if you have specific suggestions i am all ears. definitely no expert on SEO
We are troubled on every side‚ yet not distressed; we are perplexed‚
but not in despair; Persecuted‚ but not forsaken; cast down‚ but not destroyed;
https://www.facebook.com/ahkscript.org
If you have forum suggestions please submit a pull request
Thanks Tank :thumbup:
SOTE
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

14 Mar 2019, 04:00

AutoHotkey is rated very highly by Softpedia (https://www.softpedia.com/get/System/OS-Enhancements/AutoHotkey.shtml)

Perhaps AutoHotkey_L and AutoHotkey_H can have the latest versions certified by Softpedia. To get their 100% clean download certification and can use the logo. This might enhance AutoHotkey's reputation with search engines, or at least with users downloading the software from the website. And during the certification process, if there are any problem Anti-Virus vendors, this will expose them and some interesting information is likely to come from it.

Various software developers are displaying the Softpedia certificate, and AutoHotkey is already on their website anyway.
Image

However, I'm not saying this is the only or the best solution, just an idea.
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

14 Mar 2019, 07:03

I just got Norton to mark our site safe
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

14 Mar 2019, 07:05

We are troubled on every side‚ yet not distressed; we are perplexed‚
but not in despair; Persecuted‚ but not forsaken; cast down‚ but not destroyed;
https://www.facebook.com/ahkscript.org
If you have forum suggestions please submit a pull request
Thanks Tank :thumbup:
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tank
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

14 Mar 2019, 17:16

Tigerlily wrote:
13 Mar 2019, 10:47
One thing that is very apparent is the download page itself
OK Lexikos is game for some alternate download pages. we need to all prepare something that fits the theme of this site and He will pick one he likes from that
We are troubled on every side‚ yet not distressed; we are perplexed‚
but not in despair; Persecuted‚ but not forsaken; cast down‚ but not destroyed;
https://www.facebook.com/ahkscript.org
If you have forum suggestions please submit a pull request
Thanks Tank :thumbup:
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Tigerlily
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

15 Mar 2019, 22:56

tank wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 17:16
OK Lexikos is game for some alternate download pages. we need to all prepare something that fits the theme of this site and He will pick one he likes from that
That's awesome news. I'm a bit booked up this week, but maybe I can help with this next week. It's important to properly implement the header tags on this page, currently it is structured like this on the DOM:

Code: Select all

URL	Element Order #	Tag Name	innerText
https://autohotkey.com/download/	1	   < H2 >	Other Releases
https://autohotkey.com/download/	2	   < H2 >	Documentation
https://autohotkey.com/download/	3	   < H2 >	Uninstallation
For SEO best practices, you want to always start with an H1 tag that matches very closely or exactly to the Title tag - this should be near the top of the page visibly, so a user would interpret this as the title of the page once they click into it from the SERP. This is important because it's one of the first validators to users that they have in fact landed on the page they intended to when the clicked on the link from the SERP.

So this downloads page should be set up structurally somewhat like this:

<h1>Download AutoHotkey Installer</h1>
...
General information about AutoHotkey, uses, history, etc.
Download Link
Description about Link
Download Link
Description about Link
Source code Link
Description about Source Code Link
...
Additional information
...

<h2>Download Previously Released AutoHotkey Versions</h2>
...
General information about other AHK releases
Download Link
Description about Link
Download Link
Description about Link
Download Link
Description about Link
...

<h2>AutoHotkey Documentation and Tutorials (Official)</h2>
...
General information about AHK documentation
Link
Description about Link
Link
Description about Link
Link
Description about Link
...
<h2>Uninstall AutoHotkey (Official)</h2>
...
General information about AHK uninstallation
Link
...

Then the headers should be listed in hierarchical fashion, H1, H2, H3, etc. H5-H6s are not really necessary, but not discouraged. Think of each page as an essay you are writing. Title of the article is the H1, article headers are H2s, article sub-headers are H3s, sub-sub-headers are H4s, etc. Google bot tries to make sense of pages primarily using H1-H3s to sum up what the intent & content of the page is. There should only every be one H1 tag - more than that and it can confuse Google bot because it doesn't know which one to associate with the "main theme" of the page.

Title Tag (and possbily H1) would be something like "Download AutoHotkey - Get The Ultimate Windows Automation Tool" (pixel width must be ~580 pixels or less, otherwise will become truncated in desktop SERP)

Meta Description be something like "Download AutoHotkey, a powerful Windows Automation Scripting Tool. Automate basic to complex tasks - keystrokes, mouse, web browsers and any program." (pixel width must be ~920 pixels or less, otherwise will become truncated in desktop SERP)

*side note: I'm guessing that majority of AHK.com visitors navigate via non-Mobile devices, so while it may be important to also optimize for mobile users, probably not as important as many other more mobile-centric websites. In a general sense though, the majority of users are browsing the net with mobile devices, so we definitely should keep this in mind.

Notice how this page differs from all other AHK.com pages - once you land inside of it, you don't have access to the main navigation links at the header and footer of the page - this is another red flag to Google not to trust this seemingly "one-off" page. This functionality needs to be added in and at least somewhat match the rest of the website. This is not only bad in Google's eyes, but more importantly it negatively affects performance of user engagement on this page and across the entire website. There should be some eye candy on this page that motivates visitors to click further into the site, such as a call to action to start studying the documentation or tutorials, to sign up for the forums if they are a new user, to post their first post in the forums, etc. Doesn't have to be super fancy or anything, but help facilitate engagement beyond the download page.

Another aspect to consider here is what pages are internally linking from autohotkey.com to the download page? I don't see many, but I honestly haven't checked to see how many or where they are coming from. The less internal links to a web page, the less Google is going to see it as an "important" page, which affects its visibility in the SERP. This is probably one reason why if you search "download windows automation" in Google, only the AHK.com homepage shows up and it is ranked #7. Other less vague search queries, like "download windows automation tool" and "download automation tool", autohotkey.com doesn't even show up in the first 100 results. To help improve the Downloads page's "Page Authority", it is necessary to create more internal paths to that page within autohotkey.com. I think it would increase download rates and download page traffic to include a colorful always-visible site-wide "Download AutoHotkey" link in the top-of-page main navigation menu. This will help those who first land on the forums to direct them towards the download page, it will direct Google bots to crawl this page more frequently and recognize it as an important webpage within AHK.com.

Additionally, this download page suffers from "thin" content, another red flag for Google (and real users) not to trust it. Generally, a page should contain at a bare minimum, 400-600 words - the page currently contains ~150 words. I'm happy to help write more content for this page when time permits. Generally, Google ranks pages with more content higher (e.g. higher word counts). We could add a few sections in there to increase search engine visibility and make the page more "beefy". There are always exceptions to SEO best practices though - what is more important is the user base who frequents that page the most often (not Google). For instance, you wouldn't want the download page to be a 3,000 word article with the download link buried 500 words down - instead having the download link right at the top of the page and succint explanations that help the user feel safe downloading some random file off the internet as well as confirming to them that they are in fact downloading what they are looking for on the web.
-TL
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Tigerlily
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Re: "www.autohotkey.com" Is Safer Than "autohotkey.com"?

15 Mar 2019, 23:06

Also, important to note that the pages that link out from the Download page are suffering from similar page content / structure / lack of navigational links - improving upon these pages will also improve trustworthiness and page performance of the Downloads page, and vice versa. A user should never have to click the back button on your website unless they really want to - in these cases, they currently have no choice. For the most part, all "back clicks" are seen by Google as a negative engagement metric that signifies that the user was not satisfied with where they ended up and saw no other option but clicking "back" instead of clicking on your webpage somewhere to get to their next destination.
-TL

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